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bear by san

December 2021



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bear by san

The men who love war are mostly the ones who have never been in it.

I'm perversely proud of this sentence:

The American had to admit, the gadgets had gotten better in the last 38 years.


An interesting list from ginmar, regarding the service records (or lack thereof) of our current political leaders.

* Richard Gephardt: Air National Guard, 1965-71.
* David Bonior: Staff Sgt., Air Force 1968-72.
* Tom Daschle: 1st Lt., Air Force SAC 1969-72.
* Al Gore: enlisted Aug. 1969; sent to Vietnam Jan. 1971 as an army
journalist in 20th Engineer Brigade.
* Bob Kerrey: Lt. j.g. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam.
* Daniel Inouye: Army 1943-47; Medal of Honor, WWII.
* John Kerry: Lt., Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V,
Purple Hearts.
* Charles Rangel: Staff Sgt., Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea.
* Max Cleland: Captain, Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star,
* Ted Kennedy: Army, 1951-53.
* Tom Harkin: Lt., Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74.
* Jack Reed: Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91.
* Fritz Hollings: Army officer in WWII; Bronze Star and seven
campaign ribbons.
* Leonard Boswell: Lt. Col., Army 1956-76; Vietnam, DFCs, Bronze
Stars, and Soldier's Medal.
* Pete Peterson: Air Force Captain, POW. Purple Heart, Silver Star
and Legion of Merit.
* Mike Thompson: Staff sergeant, 173rd Airborne, Purple Heart.
* Bill McBride: Candidate for Fla. Governor. Marine in Vietnam; Bronze
with Combat V.
* Gray Davis: Army Captain in Vietnam, Bronze Star.
* Pete Stark: Air Force 1955-57
* Chuck Robb: Vietnam
* Howell Heflin: Silver Star
* George McGovern: Silver Star & DFC during WWII.
* Bill Clinton: Did not serve. Student deferments. Entered draft but
received #311.
* Jimmy Carter: Seven years in the Navy.
* Walter Mondale: Army 1951-1953
* John Glenn: WWII and Korea; six DFCs and Air Medal with 18
* Tom Lantos: Served in Hungarian underground in WWII. Saved by Raoul

* Dick Cheney: did not serve. Several deferments, the last by marriage.

* Dennis Hastert: did not serve.
* Tom Delay: did not serve.
* Roy Blunt: did not serve.
* Bill Frist: did not serve.
* Mitch McConnell: did not serve.
* Rick Santorum: did not serve.
* Trent Lott: did not serve.
* John Ashcroft: did not serve. Seven deferments to teach business.
* Jeb Bush: did not serve.
* Karl Rove: did not serve.
* Saxby Chambliss: did not serve. "Bad knee." The man who attacked
Cleland's patriotism.
* Paul Wolfowitz: did not serve.
* Vin Weber: did not serve.
* Richard Perle: did not serve.
* Douglas Feith: did not serve.
* Eliot Abrams: did not serve.
* Richard Shelby: did not serve.
* Jon! Kyl: did not serve.
* Tim Hutchison: did not serve.
* Christopher Cox: did not serve.
* Newt Gingrich: did not serve.
* Don Rumsfeld: served in Navy (1954-57) as flight instructor.
* George W. Bush: failed to complete his six-year National Guard; got
assigned to Alabama so he could campaign for family friend running
for U.S. Senate; failed to show up for required medical exam,
from duty.
* Ronald Reagan: due to poor eyesight, served in a non-combat role
making movies.
* B-1 Bob Dornan: Consciously enlisted after fighting was over in Korea.
* Phil Gramm: did not serve.
* John McCain: Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart
and Distinguished Flying Cross.
* Dana Rohrabacher: did not serve.
* John M. McHugh: did not serve.
* JC Watts: did not serve.
* Jack Kemp: did not serve. "Knee problem," although continued
in NFL
for 8 years.
* Dan Quayle: Journalism unit of the Indiana National Guard.
* Rudy Giuliani: did not serve.
* George Pataki: did not serve.
* Spencer Abraham: did not serve.
* John Engler: did not serve.
* Lindsey Graham: National Guard lawyer.
* Arnold Schwarzenegger: AWOL from Austrian army base.

Pundits & Preachers
* Sean Hannity: did not serve.
* Rush Limbaugh: did not serve (4-F with a 'pilonidal cyst.')
* Bill O'Reilly: did not serve.
* Michael Savage: did not serve.
* George Will: did not serve.
* Chris Matthews: did not serve.
* Paul Gigot: did not serve.
* Bill Bennett: did not serve.
* Pat Buchanan: did not serve.

* John Wayne: did not serve.
* Bill Kristol: did not serve.
* Kenneth Starr: did not serve.
* Antonin Scalia: did not serve.
* Clarence Thomas: did not serve.
* Ralph Reed: did not serve.
* Michael Medved: did not serve.
* Charlie Daniels: did not serve.
* Ted Nugent: did not serve. (He only shoots at things that don't shoot

addenda (Mine):

Former Senator Bob Dole: 1942-1945 in Italy with the 10th Mountain Divison. 2 Purple Hearts, 1 Bronze Star.
ETASenator Joe Lieberman (D-CT), former VP candidate, current Vichy Democrat: Did not serve
ETAPresident George Herbert Walker Bush: Navy, 1942 to 1945. 58 missions, shot down once. Distinguished Flying Cross.

Further addenda (via )

# Chuck Hagel - two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star, Vietnam.
# Duke Cunningham - nominated for the Medal of Honor, received the Navy Cross, two Silver Stars, fifteen Air Medals, the Purple Heart, and several other decorations
# Senator Jeff Sessions U.S. Army Reserves, 1973-1986
# Colin Powell. What are we to make of Powell? On the one hand, a long career as a military manager. On the other hand, accused of covering up the My Lai massacre. Back on that first hand, one of the seemingly sane voices in this administration when it comes to Iraq (or at least he used to be). On the other hand, a clear hypocrite ("I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and well-placed... managed to wangle slots in Reserve and National Guard units...")
# Representative Wayne Gilchrest (R-MD), served in USMC in Vietnam; wounded in action.

Link to the complete list HERE

I also addend the following, via this tool:


Senator Jeff Sessions (R- AL) 
Senator Christopher J. Dodd (D- CT)
Senator Bill Nelson (D- FL)
Senator Daniel K. Akaka (D- HI)
Senator Daniel K. Inouye (D- HI)
Senator Edward M. Kennedy (D- MA)
Senator Chuck Hagel (R- NE)        
Senator Frank Lautenberg (D- NJ)
Senator Jeff Bingaman (D- NM)        
Senator James M. Inhofe (R- OK)        
Senator Jack Reed (D- RI)
Senator Ernest F. Hollings (D- SC)        
Senator Tim Johnson (D- SD)        
Senator Herb Kohl (D- WI)

Air Force

Senator Ted Stevens (R- AK) 
Senator Ben Nighthorse Campbell (R- CO)
Senator Arlen Specter (R- PA)        
Senator Lindsey Graham (R- SC)        
Senator Thomas A. Daschle (D- SD)


Senator John McCain (R- AZ)
Senator Thomas R. Carper (D- DE)
Senator Tom Harkin (D- IA)        
Senator Richard G. Lugar (R- IN)
Senator John F. Kerry (D- MA)        
Senator Thad Cochran (R- MS)        
Senator John W. Warner (R- VA)        
Senator James M. Jeffords (I- VT)


Senator Zell Miller (D- GA) 
Senator Pat Roberts (R- KS)        
Senator Conrad R. Burns (R- MT)
Senator John W. Warner (R- VA)        
Senator Craig Thomas (R- WY)        

Coast Guard (nobody!)

Police Officer

Senator Harry Reid (D- NV)

And in other news,

One-Eyed Jack

New Words: 394
Total Words: 50,609
Pages: 221 of 228
Reason for stopping: actually going to push on in a minute....
Mammalian Assistance: Marlowe love
Stimulants: Club soda with ginger and lime, Newman's Own lemonade
Exercise: Yoga and weights
Mail: nomail
Tyop du jour: the uneasy pickle at the back of his neck that told him he'd missed something, overlooked something, failed to take something into account.
Books in progress: Ed Sanders, Tales of Beatnik Glory , Nancy Milford, Savage Beauty; Bruce Sterling, Heavy Weather
Other writing-related work: I finally got this stuff to mail packed up, and my bio written for the zeppelin anthology.


Bob Kerrey: Lt. j.g. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam.


Kerry has Purple Hearts, and I think a Silver Star. But a Medal of Honor? The only one of those I know of as a decoration is the Congressional Medal of Honor, and there is no way he's got one of those.

If your site says he does, then I have to question its accuracy on general principles. And mind you, I'm voting for Kerry regardless.
That's Bob Kerrey, not John Kerry. John Kerry's listed separately.
This was even more fun when they were both running for the Democratic nomination.
I want a pickle that channels my intuition. That would rock.
Danger Sense!
This was why I found it easier to support George Bush Sr. in the Persian Gulf War (although I wouldn't have if I knew then what I know now): the fact that he had actually been in combat.

I tend to have two responses to the hawks nowadays:

One, the Put Your Butt Where Your Mouth Is comment. In other words I ask them, "When are you enlisting?"

Two, more rarely used, "I'll consider enlisting right after Jenna and Barbara Bush do, provided they go to Iraq."
That is one impressive chunk of research. Can I use this as source material for arguements/discussions? I would totally understand if you said no. After all, you did the grunt work. I would just be swiping the facts.
I see now that it was from someone else, but I wouldn't presume either way.
Well, I swiped most of it from lj user="ginmar"> and I'm not sure where she got it--but she did post it with a spread-the-word kind of think. You might want to check her journal.
Thanks! I'll do that.
Four the last six years, I kept asking "Is 'Lieberman' the Yiddish equivalent of the term 'Uncle Tom' because 'Vichy' is too cruel?" Now that I meet someone else who feels the same way, I have my only regret that I'm already married.
You know, I voted for that man, back in the day. Even though the sunofabitch beat Lowell Weicker, who is one step down from Zonker Harris in my personal pantheon.

But God, he's gone downhill in the last eight years.
Here's another list somebody posted over at Gunmar's--
I find it interesting that McCain, the one that can really use his record to the highest advantage, is not "featured" heavily here.
He's not toeing the neocon line.
ginmar has a few more here:

and some additional commentary. Do go look.

Always Interesting

To see some of the spin involved. Ted Kennedy and Jimmy Carter get straight statements about their military service, without any sort of qualification, while all the Republicans who served and did not serve in a time of war or otherwise distinguish themselves get little editorial comments.

And I do think it's a place we need to be, doing what we're doing, more or less. And I was there, and everything.

What's going to be really "interesting" is that the baby boomers are the last generation where you can expect to find a lot of veterans; the last draft generation. We're going to be a lot rarer in the future, which means there won't be a whole buncha politicos who've been in the shit, Democrat and Republican. (In fact, what you'll probably get is a demographic shift opposite to the not-exactly-scientific survey ginmar posted. Now that we're an all-volunteer military, the rank-and-file demographic tends to swing to the Christian, lower/lower middle class, conservative. The Reserves and the officer corps are the only places where that's less the case, but I think only in the sense of saying that the lake is less wet than the ocean.) So how's foreign policy going to shape up once the veterans are the minority?

Re: Always Interesting

Yep. And that's one of the reasons why I made a point of looking up the senatorial records--because I noticed, frex, that Lieberman (did not serve) wasn't mentioned, which seemed a gratuitous skip.

I disagree with you on the necessity of the war, but we knew that already.

Personally, I come from a family of veterans, I have a *very* good friend who was ten years in theArmy, and I married into a family with a long tradition of military service: I have nothing but respect for the military.

The current administration, however--well, let's just say I return their feelings about me and mine wholeheartedly.