throw another bear in the canoe

I find the question of whether he'll face the death penalty or life in prison a fairly convincing argument that the US federal judicial system has several very severe faults ...

1. He's clearly guilty of conspiracy, but the fact remains, he didn't kill anyone. That being the case, it is in the interests of any sane legal system to view it as a mitigating circumstance (in order to give other potential future conspirators an incentive to not pursue their plans to completion: if you can be executed for conspiracy as well as for carrying out the plans, there's no room for deterrence).

2. He may very well also be insane. Certainly his behaviour is suggestive of some serious problems.

3. The obvious witness nobbling should be enough to declare a mistrial. It also gives rise to questions as to whether there was prior interference in the earlier trial.

And that's just for starters ...

Oh heck yeah. Also, heck yeah.

It also gives rise to questions as to whether there was prior interference in the earlier trial.

FWIW, Moussaoui voluntarily pled guilty -- the earlier trial didn't come to a jury verdict.

On point 1, I'm afraid that conspirators end up on death row all the time -- the driver in a bank robbery gone wrong, never having seen the fatal weapon, still often gets the death penalty. It doesn't make any sense to me either, except as a threat tactic to get one guy to roll over on his mates.

On point 2, I'd personally opine that Moussaoui is as dumb as a box of hair.

On point 3, "nobbling" is the awesomest word ever, and we Americans must incorporate it into our vocabularies immediately.

On point 1, Dahlia Lithwick (one of my favorite Supreme Court reporters) recently explained the legal theory of causality prosecutors are trying to use.

On point 2, I get the feeling that Moussaoui is less trying to act stupid than trying to make a point about the U.S. legal system. He doesn't care whether he lives or dies, but is more interested in pointing up what a sham the whole thing is. Something like (what I remember learning about) the Chicago Seven trial

I find the judge's move to leave in the possibility of a death sentence but wipe out all possible corrupted witness testimony from the TSA to be seriously passive aggressive. And while it made me laugh, it doesn't sit well at all that false testimony didn't short circuit the entire trial, which it should have, withstanding even this "time of war".

I am so tired of religious whacks who insist that their veiw of unreality must be applied to all other persons, regardless, Christian or whatever.

I dont think anyone would argue that the FBI is not a Christian organization. They are hell on godless commies like Pete Seeger, but can't ever seem to catch good Catholic Mafiosos or white Christian Nazis.


The Moussaoui case is just another in a long string of FBI coverups of the their own incompetence. I cite the Rosenbergs, all the Red Scare crap and the Black Panther prosecutions.. Also Patty Hurst, Waco, and the Weather(wo)men.. the FBI couldnt find lumps in a lump mine, to quote Pogo..

And the Musilims are even worse.. Moussaoui is a nut case, having his finest hour, the Afgans are well up in the running for most contrary prople on earth (and I'm half Cossack and half Redneck). I love the part where dude can get off being exicuted for heresy if he proves he is insane. As compared to what? As compared to who?

And skroomaul.

I was just listening to more about the Danish cartoon flap, and finishing off the last of a package of Danish Blue Cheese. I have quietly decided to eat only Danish cheese, in solidarity.

I notice the Danish flag on the package. It is a white cross on a red field.

So lets move to a country that has a Christian Cross as a symbol, and insist that they follow the law of Isalm.

(insert Expetive here)

As to who sees the irony of proving Moussauoui worthy of death via the FBI's incompetence, i suggest that the judge is quite aware of the point.

The larger issue is that the FBI is trying to divert attention from their own blindness by making a big push for the death penalty on conspiracy grounds. This is an old tactic, you could ask Angela Davis. The very conspiracy laws used in this case were rammed through by during the Nixon Administration and were used against the Chicago Seven, amoung others.

The deal is that conspiracy to commit a misdemenor is a felony, and is a direct outgrowth of the repressive Drug Laws, which attract very little attention these days.

But you can lose your house and property for misdemenor possession, if they decide to push the case. It's the Zero Tolerance Reagan laws that led to the confistication of hundreds of pleasure boats in Florida for pot possession.

They always try this stuff, and it always backfires, and they never learn.

What they ought to do, is to give Moussaoui ten years, and put him in General Population. He would last about as long as Jeffery Dhalmer or Father James Geigin (and if i spelled those bastard's names wrong, stet)

What they ought to do, is to give Moussaoui ten years

But for God's sake, don't send him back to us after five years! And don't kill him either because we have in our suburbs thousands and thousands of little Moussaoui who hail Ben Laden heartily, are now putting our schools and Faculties on fire and don't need to have a new martyr to worship.

What bothers me really is that after 5 years of enquiry, you only have brought this nutcase before the court. After the Madrid bombings the Spanish Services spent not much more than a few weeks to solve the problem and arrest the suspects. There should be a stronger word than incompetence to describe such a failure.

Me brought him?.. Not at bloody fucking all did i bring him. The people who stole the 2000 electon from my president took five years to bring him to justice. All they are good at is stealing elections. They are like the car-chasing dog. Once they actually catch one, they have no idea what to do with it.
If it was up to me, i would have shot Moussaoui out of hand and worried about the paperwork later.

The same with all this torture crap. The perverts in the white house enjoy this stuff, and i will bet that they get together and watch the videos of torture. Real soldiers would have shot a few people and let the rest go. All the Neo-cons are doing is sowing the wind.. And people like me will have to reap the whirlwind.

All right, guys. If you;re gonna fight, you can take it outside.